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	<title>Comments on: U.S. Attorneys and the Contrived Prosecution of Victoria Sprouse</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/</link>
	<description>It rankles me when somebody tries to tell somebody what to do.</description>
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		<title>By: John Boanerges Redman</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3745816</link>
		<dc:creator>John Boanerges Redman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Aug 2012 11:44:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3745816</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[BTW, FWB, read some Lysander Spooner before you (again) spout anything about &quot;legitimate government or the system established by the Constitution&quot;, OK?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BTW, FWB, read some Lysander Spooner before you (again) spout anything about &#8220;legitimate government or the system established by the Constitution&#8221;, OK?</p>
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		<title>By: John Boanerges Redman</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3745795</link>
		<dc:creator>John Boanerges Redman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Aug 2012 11:36:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3745795</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Martha Stuart was NOT under oath at any time when she SPOKE to &quot;investigators&quot;. Please get that important part straight. That is why no person should EVER answer a single question even with ones &quot;own&quot; attorney present and advising. Giving ones &#039;name&#039; constitutes heresay. &quot;When born&quot;, the same. Once you fail on simple matters like this, they have you. &quot;Go away, I have nothing to say to you. I have 1st A protection for keeping silent. From this point on, by remaining where you are, you are committing trespass and I am entitled to all legal remedies to counter that violation of my person and rights. This constitutes a 10 second warning before I commence defending myself from your crimes. Begone you criminal scum.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Martha Stuart was NOT under oath at any time when she SPOKE to &#8220;investigators&#8221;. Please get that important part straight. That is why no person should EVER answer a single question even with ones &#8220;own&#8221; attorney present and advising. Giving ones &#8216;name&#8217; constitutes heresay. &#8220;When born&#8221;, the same. Once you fail on simple matters like this, they have you. &#8220;Go away, I have nothing to say to you. I have 1st A protection for keeping silent. From this point on, by remaining where you are, you are committing trespass and I am entitled to all legal remedies to counter that violation of my person and rights. This constitutes a 10 second warning before I commence defending myself from your crimes. Begone you criminal scum.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: FWB</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3744828</link>
		<dc:creator>FWB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Aug 2012 05:09:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3744828</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[OTHER ACT.

Because the power to punish acts, i.e. police power MUST BE granted in all cases, the fed DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY to punish ANY other acts than those specifically enumerated in the Constitution.

All the 19th century Constitutional discussions state the the police power was reserved to the States.  995 OF ALL FEDERAL PUNISHMENT LAWS ARE UNCONSTITUTIONAL.


If you don&#039;t understand this, you do not understand our legitimate government or the system established by the Constitution.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OTHER ACT.</p>
<p>Because the power to punish acts, i.e. police power MUST BE granted in all cases, the fed DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY to punish ANY other acts than those specifically enumerated in the Constitution.</p>
<p>All the 19th century Constitutional discussions state the the police power was reserved to the States.  995 OF ALL FEDERAL PUNISHMENT LAWS ARE UNCONSTITUTIONAL.</p>
<p>If you don&#8217;t understand this, you do not understand our legitimate government or the system established by the Constitution.</p>
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		<title>By: FWB</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3744823</link>
		<dc:creator>FWB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Aug 2012 05:05:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3744823</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I want to ask you to think.  First, there is a standard of knowledge that states, the police power was left to the states.  Anyone who has read anything on the Constitution knows this as fact.  

The Constitution grants some police power to the feds.  Those grants are found in Article I section  8 and Article 3 section3.  The federal police powers include counterfeiting the current coin and securities of the US,  piracies and felonies ON THE HIGH SEAS, offenses against the Law of Nations, securing Copyrights and inventions, and treason.  

If the Constitution HAS TO GRANT powers to the feds to punish these specific acts, where in the HELL does the fed get the LAWFUL, CONSTITUTIONAL power to punish ANY OTHE]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want to ask you to think.  First, there is a standard of knowledge that states, the police power was left to the states.  Anyone who has read anything on the Constitution knows this as fact.  </p>
<p>The Constitution grants some police power to the feds.  Those grants are found in Article I section  8 and Article 3 section3.  The federal police powers include counterfeiting the current coin and securities of the US,  piracies and felonies ON THE HIGH SEAS, offenses against the Law of Nations, securing Copyrights and inventions, and treason.  </p>
<p>If the Constitution HAS TO GRANT powers to the feds to punish these specific acts, where in the HELL does the fed get the LAWFUL, CONSTITUTIONAL power to punish ANY OTHE</p>
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		<title>By: el coronado</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3743796</link>
		<dc:creator>el coronado</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 21:01:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3743796</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dammit. &quot;comment&quot;, not &quot;post&quot; in line 2.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dammit. &#8220;comment&#8221;, not &#8220;post&#8221; in line 2.</p>
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		<title>By: el coronado</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3743791</link>
		<dc:creator>el coronado</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 20:58:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3743791</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Aw, c&#039;mon now, let&#039;s not be so hard on ol&#039; divadab. 

While the post itself was pure class warfare hate-the-rich bullshit, it *DOES* provide an excellent answer to the eternal question of &quot;Why is it that Libertarians seem to gravitate more to the right than the left?&quot; 

Answer: because according to the ideas espoused in divadab&#039;s comment, leftists, (and div. can&#039;t be one because he adds the highly intellectual &amp; obligatory &#039;wingers!&#039; whine), leftists aren&#039;t interested even a little in Truth, Justice, Liberty and all that. And Republicans _sometimes_ are, despite themselves.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aw, c&#8217;mon now, let&#8217;s not be so hard on ol&#8217; divadab. </p>
<p>While the post itself was pure class warfare hate-the-rich bullshit, it *DOES* provide an excellent answer to the eternal question of &#8220;Why is it that Libertarians seem to gravitate more to the right than the left?&#8221; </p>
<p>Answer: because according to the ideas espoused in divadab&#8217;s comment, leftists, (and div. can&#8217;t be one because he adds the highly intellectual &amp; obligatory &#8216;wingers!&#8217; whine), leftists aren&#8217;t interested even a little in Truth, Justice, Liberty and all that. And Republicans _sometimes_ are, despite themselves.</p>
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		<title>By: Radley Balko</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3743031</link>
		<dc:creator>Radley Balko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 16:08:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3743031</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;em&gt;Martha Stewart’s case was a textbook example of insider trading ....&lt;/em&gt;

If it was a &#039;textbook&quot; case, why did a federal judge throw out the insider trading charges, finding that no reasonable juror could possibly have found her guilty of them?

The charge was that she used inside knowledge to avoid losses of $45,000. Do you know what percentage of her net worth that is? Does it strike you as an amount she&#039;d commit a felony over?

&lt;em&gt;....and then she lied under oath to an investigator. &lt;/em&gt;

She was convicted of lying under oath to during an investigation into crimes for which there wasn&#039;t enough evidence to try her, much less convict her.

I happen to think that&#039;s bullshit. I&#039;m not even sure it should be a crime to lie to investigators. After all, they&#039;re allowed to lie to you.

&lt;em&gt;I don’t know why you wingers feel it necessary to carry water for these people.&lt;/em&gt;

I can&#039;t speak for my fellow &quot;wingers,&quot; but I don&#039;t think we should ignore injustice done to wealthy people simply because they happen to be wealthy. It was a high-profile case. There&#039;s also merit to pointing out government abuses in high-profile cases.

&lt;em&gt;Aren’t there more deserving victims of “injustice” for you to champion than a couple of billionaire cheaters and liars?&lt;/em&gt;

Of course. Because this site &lt;em&gt;never&lt;/em&gt; looks at injustices perpetrated on poor people. Never. Well, maybe poor white people. Every once in a while. But definitely not poor black people. Never.

I think a better question would be to ask you to explain why you&#039;re fine with trampling on civil liberties and criminal protections when you don&#039;t like the class, status, or income level of the accused.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>Martha Stewart’s case was a textbook example of insider trading &#8230;.</em></p>
<p>If it was a &#8216;textbook&#8221; case, why did a federal judge throw out the insider trading charges, finding that no reasonable juror could possibly have found her guilty of them?</p>
<p>The charge was that she used inside knowledge to avoid losses of $45,000. Do you know what percentage of her net worth that is? Does it strike you as an amount she&#8217;d commit a felony over?</p>
<p><em>&#8230;.and then she lied under oath to an investigator. </em></p>
<p>She was convicted of lying under oath to during an investigation into crimes for which there wasn&#8217;t enough evidence to try her, much less convict her.</p>
<p>I happen to think that&#8217;s bullshit. I&#8217;m not even sure it should be a crime to lie to investigators. After all, they&#8217;re allowed to lie to you.</p>
<p><em>I don’t know why you wingers feel it necessary to carry water for these people.</em></p>
<p>I can&#8217;t speak for my fellow &#8220;wingers,&#8221; but I don&#8217;t think we should ignore injustice done to wealthy people simply because they happen to be wealthy. It was a high-profile case. There&#8217;s also merit to pointing out government abuses in high-profile cases.</p>
<p><em>Aren’t there more deserving victims of “injustice” for you to champion than a couple of billionaire cheaters and liars?</em></p>
<p>Of course. Because this site <em>never</em> looks at injustices perpetrated on poor people. Never. Well, maybe poor white people. Every once in a while. But definitely not poor black people. Never.</p>
<p>I think a better question would be to ask you to explain why you&#8217;re fine with trampling on civil liberties and criminal protections when you don&#8217;t like the class, status, or income level of the accused.</p>
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		<title>By: divadab</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3742879</link>
		<dc:creator>divadab</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 15:11:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3742879</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You cite &quot;Rudy Giuliani’s relentless pursuit of Michael Milken more than 20 years ago to the government’s imprisoning of Martha Stewart&quot; as the prosecution of the innocent.

I don&#039;t buy it. Martha Stewart&#039;s case was a textbook example of insider trading - and then she lied under oath to an investigator. These are crimes. And - unnecessary crimes - she is as rich as Croesus but still was so greedy that she cheated so as not to lose money, and then lied about it. She got what she deserved.

And so did Michael Milken - a genius who invented junk bonds but cheated to make a couple extra hundred million. He got what he deserved also.

I don&#039;t know why you wingers feel it necessary to carry water for these people. Aren&#039;t there more deserving victims of &quot;injustice&quot; for you to champion than a couple of billionaire cheaters and liars?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You cite &#8220;Rudy Giuliani’s relentless pursuit of Michael Milken more than 20 years ago to the government’s imprisoning of Martha Stewart&#8221; as the prosecution of the innocent.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t buy it. Martha Stewart&#8217;s case was a textbook example of insider trading &#8211; and then she lied under oath to an investigator. These are crimes. And &#8211; unnecessary crimes &#8211; she is as rich as Croesus but still was so greedy that she cheated so as not to lose money, and then lied about it. She got what she deserved.</p>
<p>And so did Michael Milken &#8211; a genius who invented junk bonds but cheated to make a couple extra hundred million. He got what he deserved also.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know why you wingers feel it necessary to carry water for these people. Aren&#8217;t there more deserving victims of &#8220;injustice&#8221; for you to champion than a couple of billionaire cheaters and liars?</p>
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		<title>By: C.E.</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3741600</link>
		<dc:creator>C.E.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 06:47:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3741600</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I don&#039;t know much about the Violence Against Women Act, but I don&#039;t see how it had anything to do with Ms. Sprouse&#039;s predicament.  In fact, I don&#039;t see how progressive legislation or federal intervention in state affairs have anything to do with Ms. Sprouse&#039;s predicament.  She appears to be the victim of a prosecutor who has little regard for truth or even what most people consider justice, but fraud (whether or not she is guilty of it) has been a part of criminal law since long before the progressive era of American politics.  And federal prosecutors are no less prone than state ones to grab hold of a defendant and hound her into oblivion, regardless of her innocence, and they are just as willing to use dirty tactics to do it.  This is not a product of &quot;progressive&quot; legislation, whatever may be the faults of such policies.  It is a product of human nature and the propensity for &quot;crusaders&quot; who believe themselves to be infallible becoming prosecutors.  It is a product of the general willingness of politicians, judges, the media, and the public to accept as true any accusation made by the police or prosecutors.  This attitude cuts across much of the political spectrum.  One cannot seriously suggest that only &quot;progressives&quot; are willing to parrot the claims of police and prosecutors as unalterable truth.

This is not a defense of VAWA or progressivism.  I&#039;m simply pointing out that the persecution of Ms. Sprouse does not appear to have resulted from either one of them.  I doubt even that the expanded power of the federal government played a part, since I would bet that it&#039;s been a crime to defraud the federal government since long before the Civil War, though I&#039;m not enough of a legal historian to state that unequivocally.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know much about the Violence Against Women Act, but I don&#8217;t see how it had anything to do with Ms. Sprouse&#8217;s predicament.  In fact, I don&#8217;t see how progressive legislation or federal intervention in state affairs have anything to do with Ms. Sprouse&#8217;s predicament.  She appears to be the victim of a prosecutor who has little regard for truth or even what most people consider justice, but fraud (whether or not she is guilty of it) has been a part of criminal law since long before the progressive era of American politics.  And federal prosecutors are no less prone than state ones to grab hold of a defendant and hound her into oblivion, regardless of her innocence, and they are just as willing to use dirty tactics to do it.  This is not a product of &#8220;progressive&#8221; legislation, whatever may be the faults of such policies.  It is a product of human nature and the propensity for &#8220;crusaders&#8221; who believe themselves to be infallible becoming prosecutors.  It is a product of the general willingness of politicians, judges, the media, and the public to accept as true any accusation made by the police or prosecutors.  This attitude cuts across much of the political spectrum.  One cannot seriously suggest that only &#8220;progressives&#8221; are willing to parrot the claims of police and prosecutors as unalterable truth.</p>
<p>This is not a defense of VAWA or progressivism.  I&#8217;m simply pointing out that the persecution of Ms. Sprouse does not appear to have resulted from either one of them.  I doubt even that the expanded power of the federal government played a part, since I would bet that it&#8217;s been a crime to defraud the federal government since long before the Civil War, though I&#8217;m not enough of a legal historian to state that unequivocally.</p>
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		<title>By: johnl</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3740845</link>
		<dc:creator>johnl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 02:08:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3740845</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This case is an example of what I remember as the original motivation of the civil forfeiture, eliminating the right to an attorney.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This case is an example of what I remember as the original motivation of the civil forfeiture, eliminating the right to an attorney.</p>
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		<title>By: el coronado</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3740576</link>
		<dc:creator>el coronado</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 00:29:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3740576</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You&#039;re a little late to the party, pal. &quot;no matter how much proof [is] produce[d] to demonstrate federal officials are wrong, the US media will follow lockstep behind the bureaucrats, even when it&#039;s obvious the bureaucrats are [lying through their scummy teeth].&quot;

I&#039;d say that lesson was driven home very emphatically by 2 separate outrages committed by the federal bureaucracy in 1992 &amp; 1993.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re a little late to the party, pal. &#8220;no matter how much proof [is] produce[d] to demonstrate federal officials are wrong, the US media will follow lockstep behind the bureaucrats, even when it&#8217;s obvious the bureaucrats are [lying through their scummy teeth].&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;d say that lesson was driven home very emphatically by 2 separate outrages committed by the federal bureaucracy in 1992 &amp; 1993.</p>
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		<title>By: jb</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3740357</link>
		<dc:creator>jb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Aug 2012 23:14:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3740357</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[From the link provided by FSK:

&lt;I&gt;“Attempts to undermine the legitimate currency of this country are simply a unique form of domestic terrorism,” U.S. Attorney Tompkins said in announcing the verdict. “While these forms of anti-government activities do not involve violence, they are every bit as insidious and represent a clear and present danger to the economic stability of this country,” she added. “We are determined to meet these threats through infiltration, disruption, and dismantling of organizations which seek to challenge the legitimacy of our democratic form of government.”&lt;/I&gt;

This, the consequence of minting Liberty coins. Her statement likely rings for 99% of the public. Scary.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the link provided by FSK:</p>
<p><i>“Attempts to undermine the legitimate currency of this country are simply a unique form of domestic terrorism,” U.S. Attorney Tompkins said in announcing the verdict. “While these forms of anti-government activities do not involve violence, they are every bit as insidious and represent a clear and present danger to the economic stability of this country,” she added. “We are determined to meet these threats through infiltration, disruption, and dismantling of organizations which seek to challenge the legitimacy of our democratic form of government.”</i></p>
<p>This, the consequence of minting Liberty coins. Her statement likely rings for 99% of the public. Scary.</p>
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		<title>By: FSK</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3740005</link>
		<dc:creator>FSK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Aug 2012 21:58:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3740005</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That&#039;s the same Anne Tompkins who called Bernard Nothaus a &quot;terrorist&quot;.

http://www.fbi.gov/charlotte/press-releases/2011/defendant-convicted-of-minting-his-own-currency]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s the same Anne Tompkins who called Bernard Nothaus a &#8220;terrorist&#8221;.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.fbi.gov/charlotte/press-releases/2011/defendant-convicted-of-minting-his-own-currency" rel="nofollow">http://www.fbi.gov/charlotte/press-releases/2011/defendant-convicted-of-minting-his-own-currency</a></p>
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		<title>By: CPBrown</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3739749</link>
		<dc:creator>CPBrown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Aug 2012 20:37:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3739749</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As Lavrentiy Beria said, show me the man {woman} and I&#039;ll show you the crime.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As Lavrentiy Beria said, show me the man {woman} and I&#8217;ll show you the crime.</p>
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		<title>By: Caleb</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2012/08/25/u-s-attorneys-and-the-contrived-prosecution-of-victoria-sprouse/comment-page-1/#comment-3739721</link>
		<dc:creator>Caleb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Aug 2012 20:27:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theagitator.com/?p=26284#comment-3739721</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ed note: There are three repeat paragraphs in the middle. 

Other than that, good post.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ed note: There are three repeat paragraphs in the middle. </p>
<p>Other than that, good post.</p>
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