Comments on: Meth Laws

By: conservative spartan

conservative spartan — Thu, 23 Feb 2012 03:09:10 +0000

It seems we’re always fighting the government just to maintain basic freedoms. Here we go again. Now we have an effort to restrict cold tablet sales to law abiding citizens in an effort to thwart meth labs.
Various legislative bills will mandate going to the doctor to get cold tablets. The Big 3, the police, some in the Assembly and Senate believe this will save the state money and solve our meth problems.
Excellent! A bi-partisan effort to save Oklahoma from its meth problem and save the state some money. We applaud those efforts.
From Kentucky’s fiscal note on a similar bill currently under consideration, “Although the exact amount of savings cannot be determined, the information reviewed above indicates that a conservative estimate of savings would be in the $12 to $20 million range.” Millions saved, perfect!
But let’s examine the facts behind “solving the meth problem” and its impact on us, the law abiding citizens of Oklahoma.
First, according to the U.S. Justice Department’s National Drug Intelligence Center’s 2011 threat assessment, Mexico is once again the “primary source of methamphetamine” in the U.S. That’s after Mexico banned the sale of all pseudoephedrine (PSE) in 2008. So a complete ban of PSE in Mexico produced the #1 threat of meth in the U.S. within two years. In fact, seizures of methamphetamine at the Laredo, TX customs district — the nation’s largest inland port — are on pace this fiscal year to surpass last year’s total by about 60 percent, reaching an expected total of about 1,650 pounds. Hmmm. Seems like the drug manufacturers are resilient.
Well that’s Mexico, what about Oklahoma? In order to get around the restrictions on PSE sales, a new method to manufacture meth has been developed or more accurately an old method has been rediscovered. The P2P method was popular in the 1970’s. There is no new chemistry here; in fact, most of it is almost 100 years old. Sounds a bill can’t defeat a resourceful and knowledgeable illegal drug manufacturer.
Certainly with the state saving millions, the Big 3’s good intentions are worth something. But let’s look at the new costs to Oklahoma. Instead of going to the corner pharmacy and buying $10 worth of cold tablets, you’ll have to go to the doctor.
The new system will be to call your Doctor and make a priority appointment. Go to the appointment, lose 2 hours of work ($15/hr. = $30), pay a visit co-pay of $20 (insurance pays the balance of $150), drop off the prescription at pharmacy, and go back to work. After work pick up prescription, pay $5 co-pay (insurance picks up the now $15 balance) go home and take the medication. Total projected cost is $220. That’s a $210 premium!
$210 multiplied by Oklahoma’s estimate of 1.5 million packages sold per year and you get $315,000,000. That’s over a quarter of a billion dollar cost shift.
So let’s add this up. Mexico is the #1 meth manufacturer. New manufacturing methods are getting around cold tablet bans. Oklahoman’s will absorb over a quarter of a billion dollars to save Oklahoma a maximum of $20 million. Only the Big 3 would call a complete ban good. “Government logic?”
It’s not the medicine, it how it’s being misused. Duh.
We’re glad Gov Fallin is trying to find a realistic and reasonable approach to this issue. In fact, Gov Fallin is wisely trying to find the middle ground here.
At least Gov Fallin realizes the citizens of Oklahoma don’t need to pay the Fab 3’s quarter billion dollar vanity premium to solve the misuse of a legal drug.

By: HR

HR — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 22:48:38 +0000

I remember when it was condoms that were kept behind the counter and cold medicine was kept on the shelf. Government is only concerned about Type II error avoidance, it is seldom disciplined by the hidden costs of being over-cautious, so there’s always more meddling into what people do.

By: Russ 2000

Russ 2000 — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 20:40:24 +0000

can you cite an example showing where capital punishment fixed anything, much less recreational drug usage? everything I’ve read shows crime goes further underground and govt gets more corrupt as the penalties increase…

It appears you have a different definition of “works” than the government does.

By: Kyle

Kyle — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 18:45:18 +0000

# 4 Kant,

In Mississippi it is definitely prescription. They are such a pain in the ass about it that the Doctors are concerned about even writing a prescription for pseudoephedrine. I asked my MD for a prescription when I went in for my annual checkup and he would only write for the 4h kind vs. 12h due to amount of drug in each and he didn’t want the heat from the state. The state jackasses have also made it illegal to buy the medication elsewhere as well. If I drive across the state line to buy it, where it’s legal and I would still have to provide ID, etc. I can be arrested as soon as I drive back into MS.

By: KristenS

KristenS — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 18:28:27 +0000

@FTP – I was unable to find American cold medicine in China in the mid-90′s, even in Western department stores. It was all Chinese herbal stuff, which had no effect whatsoever on my symptoms. I have no idea if it’s because of drug laws or medical culture, though.

By: Jim

Jim — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 17:36:47 +0000

Prohibition ALWAYS works.

For the STATE.

By: Big A

Big A — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 16:25:11 +0000

#18- but it’s not working

By: Personanongrata

Personanongrata — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 15:32:04 +0000

#15 | JOR | February 22nd, 2012 at 1:10 am “Prohibition never works.” It does, if you’re serious about it (capital punishment for use or possession will do it). The forty years waging the "war on drugs", the hundreds of billions of dollars wasted on eradication/interdiction/incarceration and the destruction of the constitution are not to be considered "serious"?

By: winston smith

winston smith — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 14:21:27 +0000

Cooking Meth: How Government Manufactured a Drug Epidemic

http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig8/roots6.1.1.html

By: Marty

Marty — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 14:02:34 +0000

JOR-

By: JOR

JOR — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 05:10:34 +0000

“Prohibition never works.”

It does, if you’re serious about it (capital punishment for use or possession will do it).

While that would obviously be a moral catastrophe compared to the status quo, the prohibition as we have it now works perfectly well, if you look at the aims and agenda of the people who enforce it. It’s profitable and justifies ever greater power and prestige for certain institutions, like law enforcement.

By: Ornithorhynchus

Ornithorhynchus — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 01:12:56 +0000

And now it looks like they’re going to pass the same sort of law in Oklahoma.

By: CyniCAl

CyniCAl — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 23:57:58 +0000

A nail in Hobbes’ coffin?

http://news.yahoo.com/science-overturns-view-humans-naturally-nasty-230503650.html

By: Warren

Warren — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 23:44:20 +0000

Prohibition may never work, but graft, patronage and make-work programs for otherwise useless idiots are always popular.

By: Stephen

Stephen — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 23:27:20 +0000

It’s cheaper to buy meth from Mexico in volume than it is to buy cold medicine in the USA. THAT is why there are fewer labs here. Nothing to do with the silly laws. The only people that could undercut the cartels are established pharmaceutical companies if it were legal.

By: Dante

Dante — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 22:09:27 +0000

Cold medicine prohibition – hah! The drug warriors spend all day running in circles to prevent cold relief, one tablet at a time. They only affect law abiding citizens. I’m sure there are cold medicine swat teams getting warmed up as we speak. What heroes!

Meanwhile, just a few days ago in Mexico, they found a lab with TONS of it. Tons and tons of pure meth, all in one place. The police/narcs had a really nice photo-op, and said all the predictable things about “victory” and “saving the children”. It was the biggest meth bust ever (since the last one, just a few months before which was the biggest since the previous one, and so on, and so on).

I’m sure that was the only lab in Mexico.

By: Personanongrata

Personanongrata — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 21:30:35 +0000

Prohibition never works.

How many times must we learn (re-learn) the lesson?

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. ~ Albert Einstein

By: b

Tue, 21 Feb 2012 21:16:05 +0000

there are substantially fewer meth labs out here in the woods since this law took effect.

By: Yizmo Gizmo

Yizmo Gizmo — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 20:16:15 +0000

The TSA checked my palm sweat with some chemical scanner as I flew out of the USSA last time.
I’m still wondering what they were checking for.
Pseudoephedrine is my latest hunch–you can make meth with that shit.

By: FTP

FTP — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 19:40:28 +0000

@ex-Long Islander

Out of curiosity, in which countries are cold medicines unavailable? Do they tend to be developing countries, or countries (Singapore comes to mind) with draconian drug laws?