TheAgitator.com
Unarmed Grand Rapids Student Shot in Drug Raid Identified
Friday, March 13th, 2009The 20-year-old is Derek Copp, a film and video major. He’s in serious but stable condition. The police say he was unarmed, and there appeared to be no struggle. Which makes you wonder why the hell they shot him. They also still haven’t said if they found any illicit drugs.
I particularly like this comment left on the Grand Rapids Press website:
As an officer, I can tell you that they would only serve a warrant after some lengthy investigation, including buys from that subject from an undercover officer.
And as someone who has reviewed well over 1,000 of these raids over the last few years, I can tell you that this comment simply isn’t true.
I’ll bet the sum total of the “investigation” was some kid got busted and in order to get out of trouble agreed to turn “confidential informant” and said he bought some pot from this guy once, possibly in jr. high school.
Obviousless, the cops in Grand Rapids are completely different from the rest of the country
As an officer, I can tell you that we would never have shot this kid if he wasn’t guilty of SOMETHING.
When they speak “as an officer” it means they’re lying.
Sounds like it may be Sal Culosi Part 2.
Oh, and one more thing. When they’re not speaking “as an officer” they’re probably lying, too.
the cops must’ve been upset about all the videos surrounding the BART shooting and found out this guy was a film major…
What I don’t get is how the police force can just withhold facts from the public like that. At this point you would think the mayor or city council would have forced their hand a bit. But even without any pressure you would hope police forces in America would realize that by withholding facts and be beholden to none they turn America in to a police state just a little bit more.
We’re wishing a full and quick recovery for Derek. Thanks for the updates, Radley!
#8 Bill
All the city council is interested in is making sure there are no huge law suits that might drain their coffers. So, they have as much an interest in keeping the facts hidden as the cops. They’re all part of the same club.
Stillnotking-
Just being guilty of SOMETHING makes him deserving of getting shot?
Although we do not know the facts, it appears he did not have a weapon, therefore there should not have been a shot. Period.
post #8, Bill:
“What I don’t get is how the police force can just withhold facts from the public like that. At this point you would think the mayor or city council would have forced their hand a bit. But even without any pressure you would hope police forces in America would realize that by withholding facts and be beholden to none they turn America in to a police state just a little bit more.”
The cops already think it IS a police state, and can’t figure out why we aren’t on board with that.
As an officer, I can tell you that I am well-endowed.
You’d think the police would be more concerned about Copp shootings.
@Jesse: The original post was a joke, I think, making fun of the kill ‘em all commando nature of SWAT teams and their disregard for justice and the innocent. I could be wrong, though.
My sister just called me to let me know about a student protest, hilariously held at the “Blue Free Speech Structure” on GVSU’s Allendale campus. There’s a Facebook event for it, if you’re local:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php#/group.php?gid=72373960890&ref=mf
I offered them a link to Overkill, too.
I think we need to refrain from commenting until we know all the facts of the case. Did they find drugs? Does this kid have a violent history? Has there been a history of violence in this area of town (college campuses aren’t usually in the best areas of town). All of these things could have been a legitimate factor for sending in SWAT.
And what about the kid? Maybe he did something really stupid when the cops came in like trying to hide his stash, or reaching down into the couch or his coat, or who knows, really? Sure, he was unarmed, but how do the police know that? When the police break down your door, you’d better get down on the floor right now and don’t make any movements that might be considered hostile. That goes double if you’re a low-life drug dealer like this kid.
As far as catching the kid on the way to class, dynamically aprehending a suspect on the street is a high risk operation because of all the variables you can’t control and often leads to innocent civilians getting hurt.
Please tell me #17 is satire.
So Radley, having looked into a number of these, does the “if they found drugs, they would be saying so” wisdom apply? I assume just as declining to say who shot Mr. Copp made it pretty clear it was the police, declining to mention whether drugs were found means its unlikely they found more than a misdemeanor amount.
“I think we need to refrain from commenting until we know all the facts of the case.”
Then:
“That goes double if you’re a low-life drug dealer like this kid.”
If you’re just pretending to be an idiot, then bravo!
Like the buys from Kathryn Johnston. Or the buys from Ryan Frederick.
Dr. Adamski,
You sir, are a jackass. Please keep posting here so that those who are skeptical but have an open mind can see true idiocy at work.
Except that the police admit that he was unarmed, that he was not trying to flee and that there was no confrontation. Even if you sent in the Marines (actually, especially if you sent in someone as well-trained as Marines) the kid would not have gotten shot.
When the police break down your door, they require a warrant, and generally must announce their presence under the Fourth Amendment. See Wilson v. Arkansas 514 U.S. 927 (1995); cf. Hudson v. Michigan, Hudson v. Michigan, 547 U. S. 586 (2006). Given the comments of the apartment complex management and the victim’s neighbors, the police’s using violent tactics seems inherently inappropriate, especially given that they will not tell us what they were looking for or what they found.
Yes, and someone getting shot in his home is infinitely preferable to that horrible state of affairs. Sarcasm aside, cites? If it happens often, they should be easy to come by. The police did an excellent job of controlling this situation (I lied about the sarcasm).
But you are perfectly content to insinuate a number of things about him until then, it seems. Your pharmacist is also a drug dealer; does that make him a low-life? Is it only a certain species of drug dealer, who sells drugs of which you disapprove, who is a low-life? What about medical marijuana dispensaries in states where that is legal? Are they low-life drug-dealers or is it okay when only one sovereign forbids something. Drug prohibition is a species of malum prohibitum, not malum in se, so your comment speaks more about you than the victim here. I hope he has a good lawyer.
Assuming Dr. Adamski’s legit, I want to comment on these questions:
I think we need to refrain from commenting until we know all the facts of the case. Did they find drugs? Does this kid have a violent history? Has there been a history of violence in this area of town (college campuses aren’t usually in the best areas of town). All of these things could have been a legitimate factor for sending in SWAT.
I haven’t been able to determine whether they’ve found drugs or not, but all indications are that this guy had no history of violence. He worked several jobs (at a pizzeria/sports bar near campus and selling school merchandise during athletic events), and his friends and employers found him to be an upstanding, hard-working guy.
Regarding the violence in the area, it may not be the best part of “town” (considering the greater Grand Rapids area to be “town”), but it’s far from the worst. This school is sort of an island unto itself in largely rural surroundings so it suffers from being full of kids who occasionally do dumb things, but the crime rate for the area in general is pretty low. The nearest bit of “civilization” is a bunch of nice strip malls and “casual family dining” restaurants. The greater Grand Rapids region is populated by very staid religious conservatives; Grand Valley is strongly influenced by its surroundings in this regard. (My sister was the first atheist that many of her friends had ever met, but she fits in because she’s a teetotaler and generally not interested in college debauchery.)
Of course, when an area has a reputation for being low-crime and free of drugs, its in its interests to try to keep it that way. I mentioned this on the H&R thread, but it’s worth rehashing here. When I attended my sister’s parent orientation, we were told by the campus police officer that the drug problem on campus was non-existent, and that everybody with a drug problem already had it when (s)he arrived at the campus. My mother and I chuckled, but in retrospect it seems less funny. The real emphasis of the safety seminar was the phenomenon of creepy ex-boyfriends stalking girls on MySpace, of which there were two reported that year.
To correct some misinformation I’m seeing in the comments: the Grand Rapids police aren’t involved in this. In fact, it occurred in a different county. The police organization involved is the Ottawa County Sheriff’s department, and the officer is a Sheriff’s Deputy. As Lola mentioned, this is a more-or-less rural area. The county’s largest city is Holland, with a population around 35,000. The GVSU campus is located near the town of Allendale, with a population around 12,000. Other than the campus and town, it’s mostly farmland there.
From the news report I saw last night, police entered the apartment through a sliding glass door on the ground floor. The news report showed the door, and it didn’t appear to have any broken glass, so I’m guessing either the door was unlocked or they were let into the apartment before the shooting occurred.
Grand Rapids “Press” not “News.”
WEMET is a regional drug task force that includes Allegan, Ottawa and Muskegon counties, three of smaller counties that wrap around G.R.
Shooting dogs must have just been a “gateway”….
A modest proposal:
All cops and all police vehicles, at all times, must carry full 360 video and sound.
If the record is “lost”, the accused walks, no matter what, and the cop is automatically charged with obstruction of justice.
Be patient gentleman!
We have to give the cops time to create their story and plant evidence before we can get to the truth.
From J. Jenkins comment:
“…the police admit that he was unarmed, that he was not trying to flee and that there was no confrontation”.
Regarding the alleged Drugs:
What is the likelihood, given those prescient comments attributed to the police, while not admitting that they have as yet found drugs, will definitely make sure that some drugs are “found” as evidence in this apartment?
Even, a burned-out stub of a reefer for justification of the raid?
One little problem for the police: The suspect is still ALIVE…….
I`m just saying that law enforcement officers are human, just like the rest of us. They make mistakes just like we do, but at the end of the day, they’re generally good people just trying to do a difficult job under extremely stressful situations. They are no out to get you, they are not looking for excuses to kill people.
I’m sure this officer feels worse than anyone, he’s the one who has to live with shooting someone. Cut him a little slack.
Man Adamski I really was hoping you were being sarcastic the first time. Now I know you are just a moron. BTW can you show us the evidence that the cop “feels worse than anyone.” Did I miss the apology?
I’m sure this officer feels worse than anyone, he’s the one who has to live with shooting someone. Cut him a little slack.
And would you cut someone a little slack after shooting someone in the chest if they weren’t a cop? What if the shooting was completely avoidable, as well? If cops are human, “just like the rest of us,” then shouldn’t they be treated “just like the rest of us” and held to the same standards?
I’m sure this officer feels worse than anyone, he’s the one who has to live with shooting someone. Cut him a little slack.
I don’t know how the cop feels, since more often than not, cops avoid taking responsibility for shooting unarmed civilians. Maybe he feels bad, maybe he doesn’t. We just don’t know. Just like we don’t know that the unarmed man he shot was a “low-life drug dealer.”
“I`m just saying that law enforcement officers are human, just like the rest of us. They make mistakes just like we do, but at the end of the day, they’re generally good people just trying to do a difficult job under extremely stressful situations.”
I don’t doubt that the above is true. But the rest of us don’t have the power to violently bust down people’s doors with guns in our hands. And when the rest of us make mistakes, especially if that mistake threatens the life and well being of another person, we are generally held criminally accountable. I don’t believe that this officer has been placed under arrest yet and I will be very surprised if he ever is.
http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/ShowRatings.jsp?tid=302
dr. adamski
1. If cops “served a warrant after some lengthy investigation, including buys from that subject from an undercover officer”, then this is an “isolated incident”!!!
2. I don’t have to “wait for the facts.” My Fairfax County Police department has already developed the perfect story “template” for this situation: the cop got “bumped” and had a reflex reaction; the gun was not “aimed”; the gun was not cocked; the cop’s finger was on the frame of the gun, and the bump was sooo bad, it caused the finger to i) come down off of the frame of the gun, ii) fit into the trigger guard and iii)pull thru a double action trigger pull. All of these bad things happened in the same split second that the barrel was randomly aligned with the victim’s chest. That’s our story, and we’re stickin’ with it.
If the Grand Rapid cops are smart, they will save time and money by asking the Fairfax Police to email the Fairfax Police report template in Word format. Just change names and addresses.
[...] beta version of FR33 Agents. Please poke around and let us know what you think. Thanks for visiting!Radley’s been following the story of the 20-year old Grand Valley State University student, now identified [...]
#3 | stillnotking | March 13th, 2009 at 10:07 am
As an officer, I can tell you that we would never have shot this kid if he wasn’t guilty of SOMETHING.
Well, yeah. Obstructing a police bullet.
After I found out LSU would be getting their own SWAT team (courtesy of the Agitator) I told my daughter to drop all thoughts of applying to that university. Thankfully the school was already off her list. And just a few days later THIS. I wouldn’t be surprised if every time the cops busted into a residence they brought along a roach or some seeds and some 1.5′s to throw around just in case.
GRAND RAPIDS — The family of a Grand Valley State University student shot by police said he did nothing to provoke gunfire in a drug raid at the student’s off-campus apartment.
“All he had time to do was cover his face from a flashlight in his eyes, and they shot him,” George Copp said today.
[...]
• Derek told his parents he had lifted his right arm to cover his eyes from a bright flashlight when the shot was fired. He says he did not know it was police knocking on his door Wednesday night when he was home studying with his roommate before the shooting.
[...]
Father of GVSU student Derek Copp says son was covering his eyes from police flashlight when he was shot
We even got one of those cop shootings in my area yesterday. Was a setup drug deal in a parking lot tho.
http://sctimes.com/article/20090314/NEWS01/103130035/1009
[...] From the murders resulting from the black market to all too comon civilian shooting during police drug busts the blood is on the hands of the people that keep denying real life truths in the name of a world [...]
Just a few lines…I do not believe the Officer had the intentions of shooting an unarmed person. But having been on both sides of the fence so to speak, I do want to say that police officers, or any one who has power and authority over another that THEY ARE NOT GOD..They can not abuse, lie, or what ever they think that they need to do to demean another person who does not think, look or believe as they do. Grand Rapids drug teams treat their pry with demeaning words, scare tactic’s and they don’t always have the full picture when they RAID a persons hoome. There have been law suits which speaks of their errors. I do not want to say to much more on the net, other then to say I went through one of their raids and some of the things that came out of these unprofessional officers mouths, to a 3 year old..I did try to start my own investiagion into their proable casue for the RAID I was involved in, but well we all know that unless you have money and a good attorney..GOOD LUCK.
jewells