I *like* cheap running water, cold AND hot. I like (relatively) cheap electricity - I’d like more nuclear power plants so it could be even cheaper, too. Some of my friends’ parents, who are still alive, had none of these luxuries, either because they simply were not available, or were too expensive.

Advancing technology has touched too many areas of life to discount it out of hand as being a stastistical fluke, as well.

This question only demonstrates that you have failed to understand the problem. Because of the nature of our economic system and system of government, we continue to improve in *some* areas in spite of our government’s best effort to destroy us.

However, we have also continually gotten worse in other areas, at the same time, as in those areas the Government’s particular focus has had more destructive impact.

Saying that net we’re better off fails to take into account that some people are more impacted by these specific areas of greater damage than others are.

No, no, no. He was just calling Lou Dobbs a shithead.

Let’s break it all down, shall we? When (economically speaking) has it EVER been better then it is today? You don’t even have to back it up with text, just tell me when YOU feel its been better. I’m curious to know wtf the grievers here are pining for.

I was amazed to learn that in the late 50s, early in my father’s career as a pipefitter, the cost of a motel room and three meals on the road was roughly equivalent to one hour’s pay (although his employer paid those costs, of course).

I live in Texas and I see tons of middle class people who drive nice cars, have boats, have large gun collections, have big TVs and surround sound systems, etc. Many of these are people who never completed college, but they may do skilled labor. Oil field work is big, but people do very well as electricians, plumbers, and such.

I know of middle class families with 4-6 children that get by just fine down here. Double up on kids in rooms, pass down clothes/bookstoys, rent movies instead of going to the theatre, etc… there are tons of ways to save money with multiple children. I only have 2 with a third on the way and it is still easy to splurge on the kids. The more kids, too, the more a stay-at-home parent ‘makes’ by not having to pay babysitters etc. And not having to pay an expense means not having to pay taxes on it either (because when you make money to buy those goods or services, the feds will get their cut and possibly your state as well).

Half-price bookstores are great, DVDs often go on sale for $5.99 or less, and coupons help out at restaurants. Kids eat free on some days at Luby’s when an adult meal is purchased. Standing in line the day after Thanksgiving is worth it if you are making a big purchase (plan to get the most expensive items first). Save up money and buy the car when you have enough instead of taking out a loan for it. Casillero del Diablo cabernet sauvignon is a great wine for <$10. My Honda Accord and Toyota Sienna are inexpensive, drive nicely, and don’t eat too much gas, and will probably last 10 or more years with only basic maintenance.

Maybe it’s just because I live in Texas… I guess the state you live in is a choice, though, too.

Just think how much better all of this would be, though, if the government were smaller and less intrusive!

My wife is from the Philippines. I have always used the “time someone has to work to buy item x” as the only realistic way of explaining value, since currency exchange rates bounce around. My American dollars go a long way in that country, but what’s really relevant is how long people have to work to buy something.

So, for example, here in America someone working at McDonald’s makes $7/hour starting. The most expensive value meal is typically $6 or so here in Nashville. In contrast, the starting pay is about PHP20/hour in Manila, and the value meal is PHP80-PHP100. The US worker must work about an hour to buy a meal where he works, the Filipino worker must work 4+ hours to buy the same meal.

It’s not unusual for the lower-class workers there to put in 6 or 7 12-16 hour days each week, just to get by. Cars cost the same there as here, so they’re a luxury item.

Looking only at America, when I was a kid, being poor meant that you had no car. I know - my parents owned a grocery store that sat near a poor neighborhood. The folks would walk over the buy their groceries. Over the years, being poor came to mean that you had only one car and one television.

My house is 3 times the size of the house that I grew up in. There are bigger - much bigger houses around here. I think the tendency is to compare your house/car/whatever to the biggest and best that you see. It’s really sad.

As an American, you are either rich or you almost certainly have the ability to be so, at least by world standards. Just because someone else has it better (or at least is able to keep up the appearance of having it better) doesn’t mean that you’re not well off.

I can tell you everything that’s wrong with this country with one simple story. After Hurricane Katrina, there were former residents of New Orleans and that area on TV talking about how their job had disappeared, they had to leave the area until they found out what was happening, etc. People were living on the dole in hotels and such. I was talking to a Mexican (illegal immigrant) one day after watching a news story about it all. He said that his friend had called from Mississippi and told him he needed to come down there, as there was far more work than workers. Which story is right? I think we know.

America gives you the framework to live a great life if you want it. Be thankful for what you have, and quit worrying about Bill Gates having more.

Lack of fiscal responsibility is no reason to whine, get rid of a few of your TV’s
I’d love to have a few tv’s to get rid of, but I’ve only ever had 1, the current one being at least 7 years old.
get a smaller house, stop buying the latest thing that hits the market for bragging rights, use that lump between your shoulders and make up a budget.
Done that and keep coming up short due to not enough coming in as going out.

Don’t max out your credit cards, think BIG PICTURE and not TODAY, NOW.
I have one with under $500 because our car needed tires. Something about having to go to work.

Children are a choice. And when you make the choice to have kids, you do so understanding that you’re making economic sacrifices.
Oh I love this one. So you tell me why my husbands parents were able to have 7 kids in one and 5 in the other, respectively with one person working. We’re having problems with 1 kid, never mind this assumption that we have “kids”. I’ve been married for 5 years and finding out that I was pregnant was a surprise, something you don’t think of when your on birth control.

For once I have to wonder what the heck did Drew Carey take before coming up with this video?

I already know that my life is good, and that I have lots of cool stuff. I’m worried that the government (with the help and full support of the middle class) is going to screw up my way of life by destroying our economy. I have no desire to have to wheel a cart full of cash to the store to buy a loaf of bread.

So, yes, there is an attack on the middle class, the media is just pointing the finger at the wrong people. Many politicians claim to have the solution to our impending problems, but I don’t feel most of them even realize what the problem is. The problem is, the middle class doesn’t want to take the medicine for what ails it. We don’t want to see the light of day, so we’re going to keep doing the wrong things until we spiral down into a world of shit, then we can begin climbing back out.

Speak for yourself. I buy few, if any luxury items. I work in the computer industry and haven’t upgraded any computers in my house in years. I tend to buy used parts to keep things alive.

I never buy new cars, and I usually do my best to pay cash or at least pay most in cash and pay it off within a couple years. Which means buying (quality) older vehicles for less.

I own a smaller home - in fact my kids share rooms because it’s smaller. We also live in the country to help keep costs down.

Lack of fiscal responsibility is no reason to whine, get rid of a few of your TV’s

I agree. Of course, I only own one tv, and it’s old.

get a smaller house, stop buying the latest thing that hits the market for bragging rights, use that lump between your shoulders and make up a budget.

Already on one. We have almost no debt except the house, and what is left of the loan on our van.

Don’t max out your credit cards, think BIG PICTURE and not TODAY, NOW.

We don’t even have any credit cards.

So basically, your assessment, while probably valid for some people, isn’t valid for me. In fact, I’m going to guess it’s not valid for anyone actually complaining about the economy within the middle class structure. The people you should probably be aiming this at are the people in the video.

The people who, btw, in a few years are going to be begging for a bailout, or who will otherwise be filing for bankruptcy when they can’t pay the loans and CC bills.

You can blame them for being irresponsible if you like, and it would be a valid argument. But you also have to lay blame on a government that artificially depresses the interest rate and devalues the currency. As a result, people have no incentive to save, but only to spend.

Children are a choice. And when you make the choice to have kids, you do so understanding that you’re making economic sacrifices.

Talk about a strawman. Did you even read what I wrote? Yes, I’m going to have to make choices, but I wasn’t comparing my grocery bill PREkids to my bill POSTkids. I was comparing my bill with kids a few years ago to my bill with-kids now. And no, increased consumption doesn’t explain a 300% increase in costs.

As I said, yes, some items are going down in cost. But as another poster said, those where government is involved are not. Particularly items like groceries, education, and health care. Amazingly, areas where the government chooses to not report on them in inflation metrics.

That said, I’ll bet most of you watched the game on a nice TV last night.

Actually, I didn’t watch it, and if I had, I’d have been watching it on my single TV, which is 2 years old. And it is the third tv I’ve owned in the last 15 years.

I’ll bet your houses were well heated.

Yes, it is. And I’m thankful for a market that is mostly free to be able to provide me with that technology. Of course, I’m paying about 50% more to heat it this year than I did last year.

I’ll bet you and your kids have cell phones

Nope. I have one because I have to, and my wife has one that’s prepaid for emergencies. My kids have none.

I’ll bet you ate well, too.

Relative to what? To a third world country? Absolutely. Compared to how I ate 5 years ago? No, not even close. (And yes, I had the same number of children then, and lived in the same place.)

The point of the movie is not that we’re all swimming in money, it’s that simply measuring wages and incomes as a sign of our well being doesn’t tell the whole story. We have immeasurably better lives than we did twenty or fifteen or even ten years ago, because the money we do make buys us more.

twenty? Maybe. Fifteen? Probably. Ten - questionable.

Yes, in general technology is getting better. The tattered remains of our Free Market economy are still, crippled as they are, generally moving in a better direction.

However, over the last 4 years particularly our government has overcome even its ability to keep things going. The credit expansion, devaluation of the dollar, growing regulation, and rapidly expanding debt are killing us.

Yes, costs are going down, but the number of “dollars” needed to cover those same costs are skyrocketing.

Everybody on this list should just shut the effin’ hell up and go read “Laws of the Jungle” right now: http://www.geocities.com/thornton_46/jlaws.html?2005

Drew is a *clown* who cannot distinguish between government’s increasing gouge, and the ability of thinner slices of remnant productivity to buy technological gadgets.

Yes, we have it good here today, the problem is that we have it too good. We’ve borrowed and spent ourselves into such debt, that in order to claw our way out of it, we’re going to have to give up some of the things that we now take for granted. This is going to come as a percieved hit in our standard of living. Does that mean that we’re going to have millions of people starving to death in the streets? Not likely. More likely is that our ability to purchase luxury goods will decline as the market rights itself, and then we’ll come back up to where we should be.

Pointing at the price of a technology when it is first discovered, then pointing out how much cheaper it is now, seems a bit disingenuous. Rather, they should be looking at the price for necessities, which will undoubtedly be rising (just wait until gas is 6 or 7 bucks a gallon). Also keep in mind that right now, we’re just in the beginning of what is about to come.

If it’s true that we’re better off than how come savings aren’t going up? How come wages are stagnant? How come there are so many purchases on credit? How come people are paying less and less to the credit card companies each month?

Prof.