Sure it does. Nick asked how could we be assured that the police didn’t behave exactly like they have when executing other no-knock warrants. And the answer is because they didn’t have a no-knock warrant.

Doesn’t mean there’s not plenty of other room where this could have executed better, though. In addition to the volume of the voices, there’s also the recurring issue of officers waiting only a few seconds between announcing and busting down the door, and not allowing enough time for a normal person to even reach the door.

And after reading the newest articles, it raises the distinct possibility that the officers believed Mr. Frederick’s home to be unoccupied before they began their entry. If he was sleeping in a back room, it’s likely the only sign of occupation would be a vehicle in the driveway. The apparent lack of return fire would tend to suggest that the officers might not have been anticipating a violent confrontation.

Well, for one thing, the warrants have been released to the press, and they aren’t no-knock warrants.

So although it doesn’t guarantee it, this at least raises the presumption that officers did, in fact, knock first.

“The Court has probably issued a gag order to limit the information released by the police department.”

Why do you think this is “probable?” You state absolutely no reason other than to state what the funtion of a gag order is. As far as we know the case has just progressed only a little past Mr. Frederick being arraigned. Are you going to honestly submit that the court issued a gag order at the arraignment stage of the proceedings? Why is this kind information revealed so freely in many high profile criminal cases and gag orders typically only issued after a motion by the defendant, but things are different here? Please respond.

“I can assure you that the police department did not execute a no-knock search warrant just because the officers were searching for marijuana.”

How can you “assure” anyone of this? We have seen police in some parts of the country do EXACTLY that (see the comment before yours). So unless you know something about the inner-workings of this particular case you should not go assuring anyone of anything. I imagine you agree that it sounds so unreasonable that you’re just going to assure everybody it didn’t happen that way. Please try to be less of a transparent police apoligist, offering assurances and probabilities while telling us, in the same post no less, not to jump to any conclusions.

And save that garbage about courts needng special reasons and the officer would have only used a good reason to ask for a no-knock warrant. That’s THE PROBLEM that this website is here to highlight: that courts don’t do enough to demand valid reasons for that level of force and police aren’t judicious enough to use it only when necessary.

You left out how its such a tough job and none of us should speak until we’ve “walked the streets” blah blah blah.

Try a little skepticism and distrust of your government officials once in a while, otherwise, thanks for adding to the problem.

Virginia Cop Killed in Drug Raid; Suspect Says He Was Defending His Home

The suspect had no criminal record (at least in the state of Virginia). And he says in an interview from jail he had no idea the undercover cops breaking into his home were poli…

The war on drugs is really a covert war of race and culture (an attempt to force immigrants to assimilate), and was that way from its beginnings in the Civil War era — indeed, at the start that fact was quite explicit. The safety arguments weren’t even made before Harry Anslinger, and he made most of them up.

The WoD is another holocaust, a violation of the human rights of people who have harmed nobody but themselves — and violates existing international law, including the UN’s Universal Declaration of Human Rights which forbids cultural warfare.

So I say, just legalizing dope isn’t nearly enough — there need to be “Nuremberg trials” of everyone who has voluntarily helped enact or enforce drug laws. Hopefully with the same ultimate penalty for the top architects of the War that Eichmann got at Nuremberg.

If this be treason, make the most of it.

On July 27, 2004, police in
Houston, Texas, broke open the door of
Blair Davis, a landscape contractor.
Police screamed “Down on the Floor!
Down on the Floor!” while pointing an
assault weapon at Davis’s head. Davis’s
first thought was that the invaders were
criminals dressed as police, a continuing
problem in the Houston area. A team of
8–10 police officers pushed Davis to the
ground and handcuffed him while they
searched his home. They were acting on
a tip from a confidential informant who
said Davis was growing marijuana in his
home. The plants in question turned
out to be hibiscus plants. Police never
apologized to Davis. Dan Webb, operations
commander for the police team
that conducted the raid, later said it was
“unfortunate” that Davis “got caught
up in this situation,” but that “if the situation
came up today, we would’ve
probably done the same thing.” Webb
added, “It’s not a mistaken search warrant
. . . if we believe it’s marijuana, until
we go look at it, we’re not really going to
know for sure,” overlooking the fact
that an innocent person was needlessly
terrorized due to his unit “not knowing
for sure.”352

In July 2004, several men stormed a
home near Houston, Texas, screaming
“HPD, HPD!” referring to the Houston
Police Department. Once inside, they
took cash and jewelry and shot both of
the home’s occupants. One was grazed,
the other was critically injured.

Albuquerque Police Department spokeswoman John Walsh says that Gloria Armijo and Samuel Lujan report six black men armed with pistols and rifles broke through the front door of the home at about 2 a.m. claiming to be police officers.

If they’re planning to force their way in regardless, then that’s a problem to address. I think most of us would agree that we’d prefer the knock and announce to provide enough time for a peaceful person to get to the door.

At least if they bash it down while I’m gone, there is far less chance of someone being shot.

Police can easily tell if a home is occupied (lights, cars, windows), but it’s hard to confirm that it’s unoccupied before entering. How many of these searches-gone-bad involve people sleeping or in bed? Instances where officers believed the home was unoccupied, and it wasn’t? In some cases there may be the possibility of unattended children in the home. We shouldn’t accept an automatic standard of forced entry because that only raises the risk for any possible unknown occupants.

You say you stand less of a chance of getting shot if you’re gone. What are your odds of getting shot if you’re lying in bed with a headache, and suddenly hear your front door being busted in?

1) When a search warrant is executed, regardless of “knock and announce” or the evil “no knock”, if the suspect is sleeping or in a “not fully awake and alert” mode, then it’s not logical by any means to expect someone to process whatever they see and hear. It takes time to process sensory data, especially if you’re asleep. As humans, none of us are very alert even after waking up.

2) Given the common sense in 1), it’s fair to say that the first reaction/instinct is to protect yourself - fight or flight. Adrenalin can do weird things to you, especially if you’re not used to having it pumping through your veins.

3) Cops wearing things that say POLICE doesn’t mean they’re visible by the suspect. It could only be visible if the suspect is looking out their windows and observing what is going on outside, which common sense dictates probably RARELY happens.

4) Hearing someone yell COPS doesn’t mean one should be submissive. Criminals can yell COPS just as easily. It has happened, look it up.

Bottom line is that from a suspect’s perspective, none of the measures that cops take remotely guarantees that suspects should reasonably known it really was police, and therefore should be submissive and passive. It’s ludicrous to expect anything but a fight and possible death. Given that the police probably aren’t retarded and realize all of the above, it would tell me that they want to kill and/or create a hostile situation so they can throw a litany of bogus charges. This destroys a person’s life even if you’re found innocent because you have to provide bail for the pending charges, which scales with the seriousness of the charges.

You have the right to defend ourselves by any means necessary. This is a God given right (and if you don’t believe in a creator, then it’s your natural right). The purpose of government is to PROTECT your God/natural given rights, not grant them to you.

Policy needs to be reviewed and changed by police with morals and ethics, not ones with bloodlust and “assert my power because I have the corrupt system on my side” mentality. Review by We The People should be mandatory in all police departments. Police, prosecutors, and judges should be able to be sued for their actions. This would go a ways in making a lot of them be more honest about their actions.

He still doesn’t have an attorney? Is there anything we can do to see about getting him one? I’m not from Virginia, so I have no idea how things work down there in terms of the criminal justice system. Any Virginia attorneys out there?

I suppose I’m more of a sit-back-and-watch libertarian who’s never been particularly politically active, but this just seems to me to be the sort of situation where the time for action is now and not later. We don’t want Ryan Frederick to become the next Cory Maye. Maybe we don’t know all the facts yet, but the story just sounds all-to-familiar. At the very least, there’s got to be something we can do to get Mr. Frederick adequate representation.

It’s all well and good for all of us readers to sit on our asses and shoot off our various comments, but is there something we can actually do?

Well, if they are planning to force their way in either way, then I’d have to say yes to that one. At least if they bash it down while I’m gone, there is far less chance of someone being shot. Better still would to just swarm up as I come back home from work, or as I’m leaving for work.

OK, normally I’m on the same page with Radley on these matters, especially with regard to no-knocks, but I have to dissent here.

First off, I haven’t seen anything in the news reports describing the type of entry or confrontation. Presumably it wasn’t a no-knock warrant, which should eliminate our standard concerns about their unique problems. But there’s yet to be any mention of anybody’s door being busted down, or people running in, or whatnot. Mr. Frederick himself mentioned shooting the officer through the door, so presumably they were still outside. There’s also the possibility that the officers were in plainclothes, which I’d say is a bad idea, but which doesn’t seem to play into your concerns above.

Without knowing more about how the warrant was being carried out, it’s impossible to make much of the alleged growing operation. That would certainly make a no-knock absurd, but we don’t have a no-knock.

And even assuming that the officers had the time or utility for determining when Mr. Frederick was away from home, if a search warrant is expected to go peacefully, there’s every reason to do it when the suspect IS home. From the police POV, it means that if something is found, they can make an arrest without having to track the suspect down later (after he’s been alerted that his place was searched). From the suspect’s POV, it means that you’re present to see the warrant yourself, oversee the search, witness any potential police misconduct, and make sure that the house is secured after the police leave.

Would it really be preferable for police officers to regularly wait until they believed homes were unoccupied, and THEN bust down the doors? After all, when there’s no one to open the door, forced entry is a must. Then the suspect gets to return home to find his door busted down, his belongings scattered and potentially broken (or stolen, depending on how the neighbors responds to the open entry after the cops leave), and a warrant stapled to the door. Would that really be a BETTER way of executing search warrants?