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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;Sailors Aren&#8217;t Soldiers&#8221;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/</link>
	<description>It rankles me when somebody tries to tell somebody what to do.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 06:36:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<item>
		<title>By: TRUELESBIANS</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44523</link>
		<dc:creator>TRUELESBIANS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Aug 2005 14:35:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44523</guid>
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]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Horologium</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44525</link>
		<dc:creator>Horologium</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2004 22:32:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44525</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Are you ready for the junta?&lt;/strong&gt;

Kevin Drum's "Political Animal" column has become quite popular with many on the left recently. He's a good writer, and he sometimes has insightful comments, but he has absolutely no clue how the military works. It was obvious during the...
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Are you ready for the junta?</strong></p>
<p>Kevin Drum&#8217;s &#8220;Political Animal&#8221; column has become quite popular with many on the left recently. He&#8217;s a good writer, and he sometimes has insightful comments, but he has absolutely no clue how the military works. It was obvious during the&#8230;</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44522</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Apr 2004 15:06:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44522</guid>
		<description>I don't know about that  Preble "destroy"ed Rangel. I think he did not go far enough to state that for a government to seize the lives of individuals and command them to join the army is about the most unamerican policy ever. If they can conscript them into the Army why not conscript them into coal mining? That is a dangerous job that is done almost exclusively by poor people. He also did not pin Rangel on the whole draft=lower benefits issue or a possible crowding out effect for drafties taking spots that would have previously been taken by a volunteer. 
Is it just me or does it sound like Rangel whines all the time?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know about that  Preble &#8220;destroy&#8221;ed Rangel. I think he did not go far enough to state that for a government to seize the lives of individuals and command them to join the army is about the most unamerican policy ever. If they can conscript them into the Army why not conscript them into coal mining? That is a dangerous job that is done almost exclusively by poor people. He also did not pin Rangel on the whole draft=lower benefits issue or a possible crowding out effect for drafties taking spots that would have previously been taken by a volunteer.<br />
Is it just me or does it sound like Rangel whines all the time?</p>
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	</item>
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		<title>By: Ross</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44521</link>
		<dc:creator>Ross</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 18:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44521</guid>
		<description>Corpsman Up!! Guess Rangel has no idea what that means.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Corpsman Up!! Guess Rangel has no idea what that means.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: The Primary Main Objective...</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44524</link>
		<dc:creator>The Primary Main Objective...</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 18:23:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44524</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;In Case You Needed Proof...&lt;/strong&gt;

That Charlie Rangel is a Jackass... But the news out of this debate is the slur Rep. Rangel casts on the Navy. Both Rangel and Preble are introduced on the program as veterans, Rangel from the army, Preble from the Navy. The anchor begins the segment b...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>In Case You Needed Proof&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>That Charlie Rangel is a Jackass&#8230; But the news out of this debate is the slur Rep. Rangel casts on the Navy. Both Rangel and Preble are introduced on the program as veterans, Rangel from the army, Preble from the Navy. The anchor begins the segment b&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Meek</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44520</link>
		<dc:creator>Meek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 14:29:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44520</guid>
		<description>Sempre Fi, Chris

meek</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sempre Fi, Chris</p>
<p>meek</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Chris Farley</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44519</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Farley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 14:01:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44519</guid>
		<description>I'm going to have to agree with Mike Farrell.  Some in the Navy can honestly be considered soldiers, but, as a general rule, Rangel is right.  Sailors aren't soldiers, they are sailors.  That's nothing to be ashamed of and is just as valuable as what a soldier does.

However, Rangel did mean it in a disparaging way and should be chastised.  He is discounting the unique hardships a sailor faces because he isn't "in the trenches."  I suggest Rangel spends a few months at sea to see what the Navy is really about.

And, for those of you who aren't regulars, I spent six years as a Navy Corpsman...all of it with the Marines.  Mike is right about one other thing, I am always given tremendous respect and affection from any current or former Marine I ever meet.  For that, I thank all Marines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m going to have to agree with Mike Farrell.  Some in the Navy can honestly be considered soldiers, but, as a general rule, Rangel is right.  Sailors aren&#8217;t soldiers, they are sailors.  That&#8217;s nothing to be ashamed of and is just as valuable as what a soldier does.</p>
<p>However, Rangel did mean it in a disparaging way and should be chastised.  He is discounting the unique hardships a sailor faces because he isn&#8217;t &#8220;in the trenches.&#8221;  I suggest Rangel spends a few months at sea to see what the Navy is really about.</p>
<p>And, for those of you who aren&#8217;t regulars, I spent six years as a Navy Corpsman&#8230;all of it with the Marines.  Mike is right about one other thing, I am always given tremendous respect and affection from any current or former Marine I ever meet.  For that, I thank all Marines.</p>
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		<title>By: Frank N</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44518</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank N</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 10:04:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44518</guid>
		<description>Once again, Rangel shows bias where there should be none.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Once again, Rangel shows bias where there should be none.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mike Farrell</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44517</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Farrell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 08:08:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44517</guid>
		<description>M. Smith,

If I could have,I would have e-mailed you.  FMF Corpsman were ALWAYS afforded a place of honor at any Marine Corps function I have ever attended. They always will.

For once, I agree with Charlie Rengle, "sailors are not soldiers." 

The statistics on the navy men who were killed should be compared with the army and Marine losses. And please, remove the navy Corpsmen numbers from the navy list and add them to the Marines, where they belong.

Thank you Doc Smith, and Welcome Home.

Mike Farrell
1st Sgt of Marines
(retired)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>M. Smith,</p>
<p>If I could have,I would have e-mailed you.  FMF Corpsman were ALWAYS afforded a place of honor at any Marine Corps function I have ever attended. They always will.</p>
<p>For once, I agree with Charlie Rengle, &#8220;sailors are not soldiers.&#8221; </p>
<p>The statistics on the navy men who were killed should be compared with the army and Marine losses. And please, remove the navy Corpsmen numbers from the navy list and add them to the Marines, where they belong.</p>
<p>Thank you Doc Smith, and Welcome Home.</p>
<p>Mike Farrell<br />
1st Sgt of Marines<br />
(retired)</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: brooke</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44516</link>
		<dc:creator>brooke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 06:50:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44516</guid>
		<description>Not to be a grammar bitch, Sormy, but I think it's clear that the "I think more white people should be dying" bit is clearly parenthetic to "his argument" not to Radley's first person use of "I."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not to be a grammar bitch, Sormy, but I think it&#8217;s clear that the &#8220;I think more white people should be dying&#8221; bit is clearly parenthetic to &#8220;his argument&#8221; not to Radley&#8217;s first person use of &#8220;I.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Stormy Dragon</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44515</link>
		<dc:creator>Stormy Dragon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 05:05:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44515</guid>
		<description>&gt;Stormy, if you'd actually read for
&gt;context before shooting your mouth
&gt;off, you'd see that I was paraphrasing
&gt;Rangel, not stating my own opinion.

Well, I apologize then, since I misuderstood you.

However, you sentence is rather confusing, since you use "I" twice in the same sentence, the first I referring to you ("I do think the ugly class warfare aspect of his argument is genuine") and the second time referring indirectly to Rangel ("I want more white people dying"), with nothing to indicate a change of antecedents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>>Stormy, if you&#8217;d actually read for<br />
>context before shooting your mouth<br />
>off, you&#8217;d see that I was paraphrasing<br />
>Rangel, not stating my own opinion.</p>
<p>Well, I apologize then, since I misuderstood you.</p>
<p>However, you sentence is rather confusing, since you use &#8220;I&#8221; twice in the same sentence, the first I referring to you (&#8221;I do think the ugly class warfare aspect of his argument is genuine&#8221;) and the second time referring indirectly to Rangel (&#8221;I want more white people dying&#8221;), with nothing to indicate a change of antecedents.</p>
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		<title>By: John T. Kennedy</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44514</link>
		<dc:creator>John T. Kennedy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 04:01:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44514</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;"It's wonderful that Rep. Rangel served his country,..."&lt;/i&gt;

Well actually to hear Rangel tell it he didn't join to "serve his country", he joined because it was the best deal government was offering him. He feels he was effectively forced to enlist. I don't see how this is more "service" than any other job.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;It&#8217;s wonderful that Rep. Rangel served his country,&#8230;&#8221;</i></p>
<p>Well actually to hear Rangel tell it he didn&#8217;t join to &#8220;serve his country&#8221;, he joined because it was the best deal government was offering him. He feels he was effectively forced to enlist. I don&#8217;t see how this is more &#8220;service&#8221; than any other job.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: M Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44513</link>
		<dc:creator>M Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 02:14:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44513</guid>
		<description>Rangel forgets that Navy Hospital Corpsmen provide all medical care for the Marines in the field.

Rangel can kiss my ex-Corpsman ass. And the asses of my friends who served with the Marines during the first Gulf War, Somalia, Gulf War II: Return of the Son, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rangel forgets that Navy Hospital Corpsmen provide all medical care for the Marines in the field.</p>
<p>Rangel can kiss my ex-Corpsman ass. And the asses of my friends who served with the Marines during the first Gulf War, Somalia, Gulf War II: Return of the Son, etc.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44512</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Apr 2004 00:13:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44512</guid>
		<description>No explanation needed Radley, the rest of us understood, and stormy just looks like a jackass.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No explanation needed Radley, the rest of us understood, and stormy just looks like a jackass.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Radley Balko</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44511</link>
		<dc:creator>Radley Balko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Apr 2004 23:47:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44511</guid>
		<description>Stormy, if you'd actually read for context before shooting &lt;i&gt;your&lt;/i&gt; mouth off, you'd see that I was paraphrasing Rangel, not stating my own opinion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stormy, if you&#8217;d actually read for context before shooting <i>your</i> mouth off, you&#8217;d see that I was paraphrasing Rangel, not stating my own opinion.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Stormy Dragon</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44509</link>
		<dc:creator>Stormy Dragon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Apr 2004 23:18:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44509</guid>
		<description>&gt;I want more white people dying

If you'd actually studied the matter instead of just shooting your mouth off, you'd know that "white people" are actually overrepresented among front line combat units and among casualties.  While minorities are overrepresented in the military as a whole, they tend to be more concentrated in support units.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>>I want more white people dying</p>
<p>If you&#8217;d actually studied the matter instead of just shooting your mouth off, you&#8217;d know that &#8220;white people&#8221; are actually overrepresented among front line combat units and among casualties.  While minorities are overrepresented in the military as a whole, they tend to be more concentrated in support units.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Meek</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44510</link>
		<dc:creator>Meek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Apr 2004 23:18:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44510</guid>
		<description>Today's irony.  Wonder what Rangel would have to say about this:

Saturday, April 24, 2004
 
BAGHDAD â Two U.S. sailors were killed and four were wounded Saturday in apparent homicide boat bombings near an oil platform off Iraq's Persian Gulf coast.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Today&#8217;s irony.  Wonder what Rangel would have to say about this:</p>
<p>Saturday, April 24, 2004</p>
<p>BAGHDAD â Two U.S. sailors were killed and four were wounded Saturday in apparent homicide boat bombings near an oil platform off Iraq&#8217;s Persian Gulf coast.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: John T. Kennedy</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44508</link>
		<dc:creator>John T. Kennedy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Apr 2004 22:52:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44508</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;"That's exactly what he's doing, though I do think the ugly class warfare aspect of his argument is genuine (I want more white people dying)."&lt;/i&gt;

He genuinely thinks it helps him politically, and he's probably right about that. I'd be wary of calling anything else about him genuine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;That&#8217;s exactly what he&#8217;s doing, though I do think the ugly class warfare aspect of his argument is genuine (I want more white people dying).&#8221;</i></p>
<p>He genuinely thinks it helps him politically, and he&#8217;s probably right about that. I&#8217;d be wary of calling anything else about him genuine.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: James D</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44507</link>
		<dc:creator>James D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Apr 2004 21:34:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44507</guid>
		<description>I think most of this was covered in the draft topic.  JTK is exactly right ... it's all just so that we'll be all the more afraid to ever go to war.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think most of this was covered in the draft topic.  JTK is exactly right &#8230; it&#8217;s all just so that we&#8217;ll be all the more afraid to ever go to war.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Devin</title>
		<link>http://www.theagitator.com/2004/04/24/sailors-arent-soldiers/#comment-44506</link>
		<dc:creator>Devin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Apr 2004 18:44:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.theagitator.com/?p=3991#comment-44506</guid>
		<description>Volunteer service is one of the limited tools individuals have to keep the nations military actions in check.  Congress undermines that when they coerce the citizenry into to fighting.  People continuing to volunteer for their country in a time of war shows that at some level there is support for the action. When the flow of new recruits slows considerably it indicates that even the most ardent of supporters no longer see a particular military action of being worthy of their sacrifice. Granted this tool is not as powerful today as it was 60 years ago when the peace time army was not capable of sustaining any level of decisive engagement without the help of the citizen soldier. A large standing army and the ability of congress to suspend people from leaving when there contractual time is up negates a draft until it is absolutely necessary to replace dead or wounded soldiers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Volunteer service is one of the limited tools individuals have to keep the nations military actions in check.  Congress undermines that when they coerce the citizenry into to fighting.  People continuing to volunteer for their country in a time of war shows that at some level there is support for the action. When the flow of new recruits slows considerably it indicates that even the most ardent of supporters no longer see a particular military action of being worthy of their sacrifice. Granted this tool is not as powerful today as it was 60 years ago when the peace time army was not capable of sustaining any level of decisive engagement without the help of the citizen soldier. A large standing army and the ability of congress to suspend people from leaving when there contractual time is up negates a draft until it is absolutely necessary to replace dead or wounded soldiers.</p>
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